In Reply to: RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit posted by Tre' on July 22, 2013 at 08:22:34:
Think of it as a comparator - a sample of the output is 'compared' to the original input instantaneously and if it differs, a correcting difference signal is generated to make the output come back into line."Tre'- "That assumes that there is no phase shift in the loop. There always is and that introduces it's own distortion."
There is no phase shift over the band pass region of a closed loop amplifier except near the corner frequencies. The solution is to design a higher band pass than necessary.
Open loop SET designs cannot correct for any nonlinearities
Tre" - "True but where is the mechanism for creating these nonlinearities?"
You stated that nicely in another post on this thread - "I have never seen a tube with perfectly even grid lines, thus harmonic distortion occurs" (or something close to that)
Tre'- "If you take beam power tubes (which are not linear at all) in PP and then try to "fix" it with loop feedback you will end up with very low even ordered and low 3rd but you will have HD orders out to the 81st."
Not with an appropriate band width design!
Tre'- High 2rd HD doesn't sound like distortion to the human ear. Even a little 3rd is quite tolerable but the slightest amount of upper order HD will sound bad.
Tre'- "I believe that the reason well designed DHT amps sound "pleasant" is because they are very low in the kinds of distortion that matter. They are (in terms of what matters) "reproducing the input signal as accurately as possible".
All distortion matters. Any present distortion means that the output deviates from the input signal. Closed loop amplifier designs have lower overall THD than open loop designs.
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Follow Ups
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - mgbpuff 07/22/1311:51:53 07/22/13 (22)
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - Tre' 12:27:06 07/22/13 (21)
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - cpotl 23:04:05 07/22/13 (0)
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - mgbpuff 12:33:26 07/22/13 (19)
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - Tre' 13:03:05 07/22/13 (18)
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - mgbpuff20342034 13:19:23 07/22/13 (17)
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - Tre' 15:18:01 07/22/13 (15)
- No need to be insulting and condescending - - mgbpuff 15:31:55 07/22/13 (14)
- I have just read the link for the gentlman's treatise... - Cleantimestream 15:06:40 08/3/13 (10)
- No, the article I referred to contains conventionally ... - mgbpuff 05:21:40 08/4/13 (9)
- Oh, you mean like Stu Hegemen and David Hafler... both used positive feedback to reduce distortion~nT - Cleantimestream 14:51:05 08/4/13 (8)
- Please give me a reference ... - mgbpuff 17:21:03 08/4/13 (7)
- here you go... - Cleantimestream 23:21:26 08/4/13 (6)
- Well, I am not the best schematic reader .. - mgbpuff 05:40:24 08/5/13 (5)
- RE: Well, I am not the best schematic reader .. - Cleantimestream 13:11:57 08/6/13 (3)
- Examining the A300 schematic, I see .... - mgbpuff 14:28:29 08/6/13 (2)
- RE: Examining the A300 schematic, I see .... - Cleantimestream 03:50:33 08/7/13 (1)
- Thank you for this explaination... - mgbpuff 05:37:43 08/7/13 (0)
- RE: Well, I am not the best schematic reader .. - mcgjohn@yahoo.com 09:59:21 08/5/13 (0)
- RE: No need to be insulting and condescending - - Tre' 16:38:11 07/22/13 (2)
- RE: No need to be insulting and condescending - - mgbpuff 17:54:31 07/22/13 (0)
- Push Pull and 2nd harmonic - Bromo33333 16:44:35 07/22/13 (0)
- RE: How does "negative" feedback work in an electronic circuit - Renman 13:40:52 07/22/13 (0)