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In Reply to: Take some, take it all! ... JGH on the ABX comparator ... posted by bjh on May 15, 2006 at 12:24:37:
JGH thought the ABX comparator was neutral enough not to affect the results. He doesn't deny it the quotes you provide.Moreover, he is simply wrong about being able to obtain the same results with and without the comparator or some other device that does the same thing. He wouldn't have been able to do it anymore than critics can nowadays. And he's come up with the same silly excuses many come up with nowadays for not using some such device.
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Follow Ups Full ThreadTopic - Let's play "Who is this critic?" ......... Here's clue #1 - Richard BassNut Greene 11:00:18 05/15/06 (167)
- Hmmmm-Let's see-86 Posts thus far - kavakidd 11:32:33 05/16/06 (11)
- Yep. An exercise in higher pointlessness. - Dave Pogue 04:26:02 05/17/06 (0)
- Frank Zappa got it right - Doktor Brahms 13:13:00 05/16/06 (2)
- Group polarization - Robert Deutsch 15:23:37 05/16/06 (1)
- Re: Group polarization - regmac 17:44:40 05/16/06 (0)
- Is there an easy way of counting? nt - clarkjohnsen 12:37:22 05/16/06 (5)
- After 17000 posts here what did you think the numbers on the screen after the date of each post meant all these years? - Richard BassNut Greene 08:30:11 05/18/06 (0)
- Counting what? Posts or Changed minds? - kavakidd 12:42:12 05/16/06 (3)
- I meant, is there a register accessible somewhere? nt - clarkjohnsen 09:23:21 05/17/06 (2)
- If you mean - to count the # of posts - - kavakidd 09:31:05 05/17/06 (1)
- Aha! nt - clarkjohnsen 09:45:21 05/17/06 (0)
- Precisely. -t - Bruce Kendall 11:41:19 05/16/06 (0)
- I have a GREAT idea for something REALLY new! - kerr 13:29:36 05/15/06 (53)
- I vote this be a DBT free zone. - Bruce Kendall 18:00:18 05/15/06 (52)
- Bad idea. Some critics use DBTs. - Pat D 16:17:18 05/17/06 (1)
- Well, that is where it all falls apart, isn't it? -t - Bruce Kendall 11:06:38 05/18/06 (0)
- Agreed! Great idea, Bruce... - mkuller 17:54:29 05/16/06 (8)
- So you want to exclude discussion of critics who use DBTs? - Pat D 08:22:55 05/18/06 (1)
- They aren't relevant to most of the discussions here...(nt) - mkuller 11:17:04 05/18/06 (0)
- Now, I just have to work on the fact that my vote doesn't mean squat. - Bruce Kendall 18:35:36 05/16/06 (5)
- A serious proposal for a practical solution. - bjh 04:24:15 05/17/06 (4)
- Re: A serious proposal for a practical solution. - andy19191 05:12:35 05/17/06 (3)
- Andy, Andy, Andy... - mkuller 10:47:51 05/17/06 (0)
- BSRNR - bjh 06:32:45 05/17/06 (1)
- BSRNR sounds great to me. - Bruce Kendall 07:22:21 05/17/06 (0)
- I Oppose Such Proposal..... - Todd Krieger 08:54:11 05/16/06 (7)
- I am not suggesting the topic be suppressed. - Bruce Kendall 10:51:00 05/16/06 (0)
- BUT! BUT! - lancelot 10:45:14 05/16/06 (5)
- Because listening to music offers them no satisfaction... - SalD 12:39:41 05/17/06 (0)
- They're like missionaries from some weird religion - Bruce Kendall 10:53:01 05/16/06 (3)
- It's a cult! - mkuller 15:21:19 05/16/06 (2)
- It's a disease! :) nt - bjh 17:58:24 05/16/06 (1)
- I think it's just an insane desire to impose their will - kerr 18:31:51 05/16/06 (0)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - andy19191 05:32:34 05/16/06 (30)
- No one is reasonable on this topic - Bruce Kendall 06:49:52 05/16/06 (2)
- Re: No one is reasonable on this topic - andy19191 08:21:20 05/16/06 (1)
- Don't understand what you mean be "science" or by "reasonable" - Sordidman 12:42:37 05/17/06 (0)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - kerr 06:24:23 05/16/06 (17)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - andy19191 07:30:25 05/16/06 (16)
- There are no objectivists - Sordidman 12:53:07 05/17/06 (0)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - kerr 08:02:08 05/16/06 (14)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - andy19191 13:43:52 05/16/06 (11)
- By the way - kerr 18:11:16 05/16/06 (0)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - kerr 18:03:37 05/16/06 (9)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - andy19191 04:08:25 05/17/06 (8)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - kerr 04:55:19 05/17/06 (7)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - andy19191 06:18:29 05/17/06 (6)
- Re: "Education does tend to open rather than close the mind." - geoffkait 08:48:24 05/17/06 (0)
- BTDTYFNGISOIGTSBMHATOBW - kerr 07:56:00 05/17/06 (4)
- You did really well, IMO. FWIW - Sordidman 13:18:18 05/17/06 (1)
- Not really, but the reason is... - kerr 14:58:29 05/17/06 (0)
- OCWABOAAAHZ-EBGCATRSOCU - bjh 08:18:33 05/17/06 (1)
- NS! - kerr 10:28:50 05/17/06 (0)
- Pretty damned good - - kavakidd 08:32:07 05/16/06 (1)
- I've been around the debate awhile - kerr 09:20:39 05/16/06 (0)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - thetubeguy1954 06:08:36 05/16/06 (8)
- Re: I vote this be a DBT free zone. - andy19191 07:53:56 05/16/06 (7)
- What happened to the tradition of using "science" - bjh 08:08:07 05/16/06 (6)
- Re: What happened to the tradition of using "science" - andy19191 13:58:47 05/16/06 (1)
- OK, so we'll call this episode of "Prove It" complete. Such fun ... Yaaaaaaaaaaawn nt - bjh 17:57:07 05/16/06 (0)
- If there were a science behind wines, cars, and audio, we would have one brand. nt - Norm 09:38:15 05/16/06 (3)
- That's nonsense. But the sales of "Two-Buck Chuck" could explode if winos perform like audiophiles in their DBTs ! - Richard BassNut Greene 09:53:35 05/16/06 (2)
- That is certainly a conclusive argument. - Norm 11:11:08 05/16/06 (1)
- Re: That is certainly a conclusive argument. - regmac 17:34:33 05/16/06 (0)
- Second that.......... - JohnL 22:31:01 05/15/06 (1)
- What??? - kerr 04:43:37 05/16/06 (0)
- Really....... What is the point? - TomJ 13:09:23 05/15/06 (0)
- What's your point, Mr. Greene? - John Atkinson 11:40:35 05/15/06 (28)
- Initially, I was kind of curious about that one myself. - regmac 15:47:41 05/16/06 (2)
- "Almost makes one yearn for DonT, doesn't it?" It does not! nt - clarkjohnsen 10:05:09 05/17/06 (1)
- I take it you two don't exchange XMAS cards? :) NT - regmac 13:36:50 05/17/06 (0)
- J. Gordon Holt's point was that double blind tests would finally prove he could really hear differences he wrote about - Richard BassNut Greene 09:24:21 05/16/06 (10)
- You are on record (below) - bjh 09:39:25 05/16/06 (9)
- 100+ blind tests but only 3 positives for electronics & wires & many null results(Sighted auditions = NO null results) - Richard BassNut Greene 17:08:29 05/17/06 (3)
- Richard, when I asked ... - bjh 20:15:38 05/17/06 (2)
- 100+ DBTs with only 3 positive results for electronics & wires is within the expected margin of error(4 false positives) - Richard BassNut Greene 08:52:38 05/18/06 (1)
- RBSD - bjh 09:58:04 05/18/06 (0)
- You are just proving you are no logician. - Pat D 14:06:31 05/16/06 (4)
- No comment deserved. nt - bjh 17:39:28 05/16/06 (3)
- So you think probability isn't probability but certainty? - Pat D 16:24:30 05/17/06 (2)
- Soitenly ...but it's wonderful to know sighted auditions NEVER have any errors -- ALL components ALWAYS sound different - Richard BassNut Greene 09:24:41 05/18/06 (1)
- Re: Soitenly ...but it's wonderful to know sighted auditions NEVER have any errors -- ALL components ALWAYS sound differ - Pat D 13:17:09 05/23/06 (0)
- I'm still bowled over by your previous postings - Soundmind 17:35:32 05/15/06 (13)
- Congradulations!, you've just been selected as the next contestant in the "Prove It" game. LOL nt - bjh 09:48:30 05/16/06 (1)
- FOMCLMAOAPMP! - kerr 09:56:26 05/16/06 (0)
- Who is claiming the ability to hear a 0.25dB change to one slider of a 30 band equalizer? ... Any proof of this ability? - Richard BassNut Greene 09:31:58 05/16/06 (9)
- Why do equalizers have 0.25db gradations if they are inaudible? (nt) - SalD 16:17:00 05/16/06 (0)
- Re: Who is claiming the ability to hear a 0.25dB change to one slider of a 30 band equalizer? ... Any proof of this abil - John Atkinson 10:32:43 05/16/06 (6)
- The sentence suggested someone could hear a 0.25dB change in any 30-band equalizer band & I didn't believe it - Richard BassNut Greene 16:17:10 05/17/06 (2)
- Skepticism & proof - John Atkinson 06:32:03 05/18/06 (1)
- Skepticism only increases with responses such as: "I am not obliged to prove anything ... " - Richard BassNut Greene 09:54:09 05/18/06 (0)
- Why equalizers for mastering recordings but not for playback? - Soundmind 11:11:49 05/16/06 (2)
- Re: Why equalizers for mastering recordings but not for playback? - John Atkinson 11:56:10 05/16/06 (1)
- Re: Why equalizers for mastering recordings but not for playback? - Soundmind 14:21:24 05/16/06 (0)
- What puzzles me most..... - Soundmind 10:06:31 05/16/06 (0)
- Re: I'm still bowled over by your previous postings - John Atkinson 04:12:04 05/16/06 (0)
- I'm guessing it's not HP... - Cochise 11:33:50 05/15/06 (0)
- I'm thinking Aczel... - Bob Rex 11:28:42 05/15/06 (23)
- Not Aczel, but here is a great quote from Aczel you may enjoy ... or maybe not? - Richard BassNut Greene 07:30:55 05/16/06 (22)
- Simple answer - kerr 08:06:06 05/16/06 (18)
- A subjective audiophile with a good sense of humor like you, is as rare as ... - Richard BassNut Greene 09:40:20 05/16/06 (17)
- Re: " Democrat saying something positive about America" - Rob Doorack 07:24:58 05/17/06 (7)
- You Dumbocraps just have no sense of humor ! - Richard BassNut Greene 17:27:40 05/17/06 (6)
- Re: You Dumbocraps just have no sense of humor ! - Rob Doorack 07:47:31 05/18/06 (1)
- Rob you can call me ANYTHING but please don't call me a Repooplican --- Please! - Richard BassNut Greene 10:22:33 05/18/06 (0)
- Richard, thanks for that clarification - andy_c 21:16:53 05/17/06 (3)
- Aw geez! NOW ya REALLY did it! - kerr 14:23:07 05/18/06 (2)
- I can prove I'm sane -- just look at these test results! - Richard BassNut Greene 09:44:21 05/19/06 (1)
- LOL! Perhaps they found nothing... - kerr 11:28:09 05/19/06 (0)
- I knew you'd take it as it was intended! :) - kerr 09:53:51 05/16/06 (8)
- Yet another golden-ear-big-ego-my-stereo-is-better-than-yours-and- I-can-hear-better-than-you fantasy ! - Richard BassNut Greene 17:35:02 05/17/06 (7)
- Re: Yet another golden-ear-big-ego-my-stereo-is-better-than-yours-and- I-can-hear-better-than-you fantasy ! - kerr 11:31:58 05/19/06 (0)
- Re: Yet another golden-ear-big-ego-my-stereo-is-better-than-yours-and- I-can-hear-better-than-you fantasy ! - bjh 18:32:42 05/17/06 (5)
- bjh those ALL CAPS and multiple exclamation points !!!!!!! were so exciting I actually read your post this time - Richard BassNut Greene 10:33:36 05/18/06 (4)
- Jesus Richard, chill out ... it was a joke! Did you actually miss it! LOL - bjh 11:40:39 05/18/06 (3)
- I forgot what we were disagreeing about, however I'm sure you were *C*O*M*P*L*E*T*E*L*Y* wrong about whatever it was - Richard BassNut Greene 13:42:11 05/18/06 (2)
- I like this new theme of foolishness, the previous, pointing out your lack of credibility, was getting boring! nt - bjh 14:36:40 05/18/06 (1)
- Cut out the jokes and let's get back to the serious business of criticizing each others posts & comparing each others.. - Richard BassNut Greene 09:48:52 05/19/06 (0)
- Not. Actually I still can't get over the fact he returned to audio after he disgraced himself! No shame apparently. nt - bjh 07:52:49 05/16/06 (2)
- Here's one for ya..... - Bob Rex 16:39:58 05/16/06 (0)
- And yet he can still refer to OTHERS as hypocrites! (nt) - kerr 08:06:49 05/16/06 (0)
- ... "Who is this critic?" ......... Here's clue #2 - Richard BassNut Greene 11:15:18 05/15/06 (45)
- Re: ... "Who is this critic?" ......... Here's clue #3 - Richard BassNut Greene 11:21:15 05/15/06 (44)
- Who is this critic? -- Final clue #4 - Richard BassNut Greene 11:23:03 05/15/06 (43)
- My guess: J. Gordon Holt (nt) - John N 11:39:49 05/15/06 (42)
- He was wrong about this... - mkuller 14:11:00 05/15/06 (3)
- Holt was right about the ABX comparator -- just wrong about the "house" built with this tool - Richard BassNut Greene 09:47:41 05/16/06 (2)
- So says the guy who with the Magic Wand ... - bjh 10:05:08 05/16/06 (1)
- I responded to that post brilliantly, as usual - Richard BassNut Greene 17:43:45 05/17/06 (0)
- Of course it was. - Pat D 11:53:38 05/15/06 (37)
- "...which takes the fraud out of subjective testing" - andy_c 18:37:10 05/15/06 (1)
- Re: "...which takes the fraud out of subjective testing" - Pat D 11:23:19 05/18/06 (0)
- Take some, take it all! ... JGH on the ABX comparator ... - bjh 12:24:37 05/15/06 (34)
- Holt went crazy over the very first Sony CD player too - Dave Pogue 16:48:10 05/15/06 (25)
- i never heard a 'first sony' - hifitommy 19:07:19 05/15/06 (0)
- Well I don't know? - bjh 17:25:39 05/15/06 (23)
- If the old CD players hold up in DBTs, - Dave Pogue 17:55:57 05/15/06 (22)
- Re: If the old CD players hold up in DBTs, - Soundmind 19:04:36 05/15/06 (21)
- Why disagree about mediocrity? (nt) - E-Stat 19:19:12 05/15/06 (20)
- I don't. When it comes to reproducing music, all current systems are mediocre (or worse) (nt) - Soundmind 20:48:08 05/15/06 (19)
- Yeah nothing like - bjh 21:07:14 05/15/06 (18)
- OK, since you asked about my system I'll finally discuss it; - Soundmind 04:47:53 05/16/06 (17)
- Re: OK, since you asked about my system I'll finally discuss it; - David Yost 08:20:32 05/16/06 (4)
- Re: OK, since you asked about my system I'll finally discuss it; - Soundmind 09:01:48 05/16/06 (3)
- Re: OK, since you asked about my system I'll finally discuss it; - David Yost 09:32:12 05/16/06 (2)
- Re: OK, since you asked about my system I'll finally discuss it; - Soundmind 09:48:17 05/16/06 (1)
- Let me refresh your memory... - E-Stat 10:08:29 05/16/06 (0)
- Let's make it real simple ... - bjh 08:19:42 05/16/06 (0)
- Translations - E-Stat 06:42:04 05/16/06 (1)
- Lordy! nt - clarkjohnsen 10:19:33 05/16/06 (0)
- Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - bjh 05:34:30 05/16/06 (8)
- Re: Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - Soundmind 06:10:08 05/16/06 (7)
- Re: Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - Grant 07:07:07 05/16/06 (1)
- Re: Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - Soundmind 08:04:18 05/16/06 (0)
- Re: Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - thetubeguy1954 06:43:53 05/16/06 (3)
- Re: Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - Soundmind 07:16:03 05/16/06 (2)
- Re: Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - regmac 07:45:02 05/16/06 (1)
- Sell you CDP and get a SOTA $50 DVD/CD Player. - bjh 07:57:56 05/16/06 (0)
- Re: Well it would appear that you've answered some of your - kerr 06:34:09 05/16/06 (0)
- Changing the topic. - Pat D 05/15/0612:57:22 05/15/06 (7)
- Please 'splain something to me - E-Stat 14:34:09 05/15/06 (5)
- Holt's statement flies in the face of Audio Aylum stated facts regarding DBT and ABX - Soundmind 18:59:25 05/15/06 (2)
- Trying to figure out where you meant to place this post (nt) - E-Stat 09:13:42 05/16/06 (1)
- Re: Trying to figure out where you meant to place this post (nt) - Soundmind 09:50:57 05/16/06 (0)
- You'd better ask Mr. Holt. (nt) - Pat D 18:21:31 05/15/06 (1)
- Don't need to - E-Stat 18:59:11 05/15/06 (0)
- No comment deserved. nt - bjh 13:05:11 05/15/06 (0)
Follow Ups
- Changing the topic. - Pat D 05/15/0612:57:22 05/15/06 (7)
- Please 'splain something to me - E-Stat 14:34:09 05/15/06 (5)
- Holt's statement flies in the face of Audio Aylum stated facts regarding DBT and ABX - Soundmind 18:59:25 05/15/06 (2)
- Trying to figure out where you meant to place this post (nt) - E-Stat 09:13:42 05/16/06 (1)
- Re: Trying to figure out where you meant to place this post (nt) - Soundmind 09:50:57 05/16/06 (0)
- You'd better ask Mr. Holt. (nt) - Pat D 18:21:31 05/15/06 (1)
- Don't need to - E-Stat 18:59:11 05/15/06 (0)
- No comment deserved. nt - bjh 13:05:11 05/15/06 (0)
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