In Reply to: NOBODY listens to loudspeakers in an anechoic chamber posted by KlausR. on May 11, 2006 at 05:37:24:
If automotive designers tested their efforts on a test track conceptually as restricted and unrepresentative of real world driving conditions as an anechoic chamber is for testing loudspeakers, they would be constrained to a dry level straightaway. A good test track simulates every road condition and hazard a driver is likely to face and some which are rare but do happen.Engineers (as opposed to tinkerers) don't guess, they know fairly well in advance what the performance of their mental product is likely to be when it is built and used and they have to anticipate every variable it is likely to encounter and make provisions for them in their designs. That's a good definition of what engineering is. And while financial and ad experts may judge the success or failure of a product by how the market likes it, how many units were sold, or how much profit it makes, other engineers judge it by how well it performs its intended function. By this standard, loudspeakers get a poor or at best a fair rating. If designers don't, won't, or can't get the job done, it's partly out of ignorance, partly out of laziness, partly out of lack of time and money, and partly because of the primitive state of the art as it exists today (not as ad hype would have us believe.)
Even in an anechoic chamber, the necessity for measuring polar response to characterize the complete energy output is often overlooked. How can you possibly know, calculate, guess how a speaker will work in a real room, if you don't know the nature of the energy projected at different parts of it. Can engineers take their speakers into typical listening rooms, place them in different positions, and find out what happens? Within finite limits, yes. Do they? Where have you seen any data from any of them or provisions in any of them to adjust for those differences?
What SHOULD the plan for designing loudspeakers be in specific terms?
Define the end result required
Define the likely working environment
Provde means to compensate for differences from one environment to another
Test the efficacy of meeting the stated objectives in different environments.What DO they do?
Throw a few speakers, some electronic components, and some stuffing in a wooden box and when one comes out that you think will sell, market the hell out of it.Maybe other people are only too happy to spend their hard earned cash on the products of such poorly conceived efforts but I won't. I can easily build an infinite variety equally bad speakers as any of them myself for a lot less money.
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Follow Ups
- Re: NOBODY listens to loudspeakers in an anechoic chamber - Soundmind 05/11/0606:10:53 05/11/06 (66)
- Re: Polar response - KlausR. 09:12:58 05/11/06 (5)
- Re: Polar response - Soundmind 09:28:06 05/11/06 (4)
- You're welcome but... - KlausR. 09:34:17 05/11/06 (3)
- Re: You're welcome but... - Soundmind 09:47:11 05/11/06 (2)
- Polar response again - KlausR. 10:59:04 05/11/06 (1)
- Re: Polar response again - Soundmind 11:44:13 05/11/06 (0)
- Question - John Atkinson 06:41:16 05/11/06 (59)
- I answered your question, now here's one for you - Soundmind 10:15:50 05/11/06 (34)
- No - John Atkinson 12:02:54 05/11/06 (0)
- Yes, a 5-band graphic equalizer, isn't it? Did you say it was 70's vintage? (sorry, but you've no system listed). nt - bjh 10:53:23 05/11/06 (32)
- Re: Yes, a 5-band graphic equalizer, isn't it? Did you say it was 70's vintage? (sorry, but you've no system listed). nt - Soundmind 13:12:15 05/11/06 (31)
- What preamp has a built-in 5-band equalizer? -t - Bruce Kendall 15:47:16 05/11/06 (27)
- A 1974 Harman-Kardon Citation 11 - E-Stat 16:02:53 05/11/06 (26)
- Just wondering. - Bruce Kendall 18:31:56 05/11/06 (0)
- Re: A 1974 Harman-Kardon Citation 11 - Soundmind 17:34:31 05/11/06 (24)
- I'm shocked!! - E-Stat 17:40:30 05/11/06 (23)
- Re: I'm shocked!! - Soundmind 17:52:54 05/11/06 (22)
- 2 years??!! - Bruce from DC 07:55:18 05/12/06 (12)
- Re: 2 years??!! - Soundmind 08:58:41 05/12/06 (11)
- Re: "measures flat but doesn't sound flat" - Bruce from DC 15:12:02 05/12/06 (1)
- Reproducing sound to be perceived as identical to something else is always subjective, that's what perception means - Soundmind 16:03:52 05/12/06 (0)
- Since when did Behringer become an audiophile firm? - E-Stat 14:59:29 05/12/06 (8)
- What do you mean "WE" kimosabe? - Soundmind 16:13:26 05/12/06 (7)
- Are you kidding? - E-Stat 16:27:15 05/12/06 (6)
- Maybe I read your post wrong, looks like you fell off the deep end - Soundmind 17:10:20 05/12/06 (5)
- You said you didn't like how they calculated "flat" and blamed audiophiles - E-Stat 17:19:46 05/12/06 (4)
- Re: You said you didn't like how they calculated "flat" and blamed audiophiles - Soundmind 17:46:11 05/12/06 (3)
- You left out one detail - E-Stat 18:48:02 05/12/06 (2)
- Re: You left out one detail - Soundmind 19:27:23 05/12/06 (1)
- Yeah, just think how much gear that could have - bjh 14:08:14 05/13/06 (0)
- Ok, now I'm relieved - E-Stat 18:23:11 05/11/06 (8)
- Re: Ok, now I'm relieved - Soundmind 18:54:00 05/11/06 (7)
- Wow! I guess amongst graphic equalizer buffs you must be The Man! :) nt - bjh 19:21:31 05/11/06 (6)
- I find them a useful and powerful tool when properly used - Soundmind 23:38:54 05/11/06 (5)
- What audiophiles also tend to forget is... - KlausR. 08:51:08 05/12/06 (4)
- Re: What audiophiles also tend to forget is... - Soundmind 09:03:33 05/12/06 (3)
- Re: What audiophiles also tend to forget is... - Pat D 17:19:00 05/12/06 (2)
- Another funny point - Soundmind 18:19:49 05/12/06 (1)
- Have to wear the boots again with this one... - E-Stat 18:55:33 05/12/06 (0)
- Did you dispense with the BSR 10 band units? - E-Stat 13:38:38 05/11/06 (2)
- Eureka! I believe you've uncovered a means to clear the Dark Gloomy Cloud hanging over this forum, ... - bjh 13:46:32 05/11/06 (1)
- As an "irrational audiophile", I will likely surprise the hell out of SM - E-Stat 14:33:52 05/11/06 (0)
- Re: Question - RGA 07:36:19 05/11/06 (3)
- "I'm sure he'd be less hostile in person." One would hope. However... - clarkjohnsen 08:47:23 05/11/06 (0)
- "...I think a manufacturer should offer him a job" - bjh 08:35:36 05/11/06 (1)
- I was being genuine... - RGA 08:54:55 05/12/06 (0)
- Re: Question - Soundmind 07:17:13 05/11/06 (19)
- Re: Question - hexenboden 10:48:09 05/11/06 (0)
- Re: Question - Bruce from DC 10:15:08 05/11/06 (0)
- I pick "C" - Pjay 08:36:39 05/11/06 (16)
- Re: I pick "C" - Soundmind 09:12:40 05/11/06 (6)
- Re: I pick "C" - Pjay 11:30:16 05/11/06 (0)
- Have to agree - kerr 10:28:38 05/11/06 (1)
- Re: Have to agree - Soundmind 11:55:47 05/11/06 (0)
- "color television" huh? Tell me, when was the last time you attempted to "walk into" some scene on your TV? nt - bjh 10:07:45 05/11/06 (2)
- Yeah, if he thinks color television problems have been "solved," - Dave Pogue 11:01:16 05/11/06 (0)
- ps. Have you ever noticed that when you walk behind your TV set - bjh 10:44:44 05/11/06 (0)
- Allow me to add a point? - KlausR. 09:00:57 05/11/06 (8)
- Re: Allow me to add a point? - Soundmind 09:21:23 05/11/06 (7)
- Re: And what do you suppose would happen if actual musicians performed in your listening room? - KlausR. 09:40:47 05/11/06 (6)
- Re: And what do you suppose would happen if actual musicians performed in your listening room? - Soundmind 09:51:36 05/11/06 (5)
- Back to mono? (nt) - KlausR. 10:48:30 05/11/06 (4)
- Re: Back to mono? (nt) - Soundmind 11:46:09 05/11/06 (3)
- Use two dozen of my 'stats - E-Stat 14:40:01 05/11/06 (2)
- you won't get much privacy behind those dressing screens. - Soundmind 17:30:39 05/11/06 (1)
- The best doesn't come cheaply -t - E-Stat 18:16:21 05/11/06 (0)