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Classical Court From Perotin to Prokofiev (and beyond), performed by Caruso to Khatia, it's all here. |
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Classical Court From Perotin to Prokofiev (and beyond), performed by Caruso to Khatia, it's all here. |
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In Reply to: I believe that most in here of a certain age have heard the same 30 to 50 "reference" recordings, they've posted by jdaniel@jps.net on September 2, 2020 at 13:31:30:
But when it comes to "open" as a description of a quality of a recording I don't know what you are talking about. And if you do know what you are talking about it really shouldn't be that hard to define it. "silky" that's another good one. But let's just focus on "open." what does that actually mean in this context? "Front to back" That's pretty straight forward. It's quite literally a perception of front to back audible perception of depth/distance of the aural images. super easy to define. Things like "bright" or "dark" are easy. Frequency response curves that emphasize or de-emphasize the treble region. "Transparent" again easy. Objectively it describes a lack of audible distortion in the audio chain. Subjectively it describes a lack of noticble audible distortion in the entire chain from microphones to ears. WTF does "open" Mean?
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Follow Ups Full ThreadTopic - Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - LtMandella 17:31:03 08/29/20 (124)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - sser2 00:39:28 09/6/20 (2)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - LtMandella 16:54:31 09/6/20 (0)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - pbarach 05:10:11 09/6/20 (0)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - alc777 10:13:51 09/2/20 (9)
- Man! I'd forgotten that Tjeknavorian recording! [nt] - Chris from Lafayette 12:50:06 09/2/20 (6)
- Isn't that an immediate eye-catching cover design? :) - alc777 19:51:12 09/2/20 (5)
- Yes - always was! [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 18:16:03 09/3/20 (4)
- I bought when released. The best part for me was lapping up all the Digital hoopla on back cover. Nt - jdaniel@jps.net 18:50:55 09/3/20 (3)
- RE: I bought when released. The best part for me was lapping up all the Digital hoopla on back cover. Nt - alc777 20:39:09 09/3/20 (2)
- B&W speakers - pbarach 04:40:40 09/4/20 (1)
- Now that is a certified audiophile! :) / nt - alc777 06:01:04 09/4/20 (0)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - LtMandella 10:46:28 09/2/20 (1)
- You're welcome. - alc777 20:21:36 09/2/20 (0)
- I also like the Maazel/Cleve. Scheherazade, but...... - Rick W 10:21:14 08/31/20 (1)
- RE: I also like the Maazel/Cleve. Scheherazade, but...... - LtMandella 10:23:46 08/31/20 (0)
- I see a lot of love for the Beechem - Analog Scott 10:54:34 08/30/20 (80)
- RE: I see a lot of love for the Beechem - kuma 18:43:40 08/30/20 (6)
- Somehow Jane Russell to me does NOT.... - TWB 12:53:41 08/31/20 (3)
- No! No! You both have it wrong! - Chris from Lafayette 16:38:27 08/31/20 (2)
- Why in the world would you want a second rate version.... - TWB 23:04:53 08/31/20 (0)
- Here's the most accurate visual analogy, Reiner vs Beecham, as recorded - jdaniel@jps.net 17:24:50 08/31/20 (0)
- That's an interesting visual analogy - Analog Scott 22:07:12 08/30/20 (0)
- RE: :-) /n - Ivan303 20:12:47 08/30/20 (0)
- Do you recall where the alleged "heavy-handed" rubato is located that the Brit Critics raved about? - jdaniel@jps.net 15:12:11 08/30/20 (0)
- I agree with you, Scott - Chris from Lafayette 11:29:20 08/30/20 (71)
- Compared to the screwbato we're often subjected to today, I don't find Beecham's to sound unnatural at all - jdaniel@jps.net 12:58:13 08/30/20 (70)
- "The soundstage just doesn't seem to open up" [in the Reiner recording] - Chris from Lafayette 15:02:33 08/30/20 (69)
- No, fact. The Beecham recording projects a much more natural, open sound, with hall interaction preserved. nt - jdaniel@jps.net 15:13:52 08/30/20 (68)
- Sound is subjective - jimbill 22:04:47 09/1/20 (2)
- That's why I said **more** open and natural as opposed to **perfectly** open and natural. - jdaniel@jps.net 07:27:20 09/2/20 (1)
- Your own live listening experiences in which halls? [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 12:48:16 09/2/20 (0)
- A fact? How can that possibly be a fact? - Analog Scott 01:06:21 08/31/20 (63)
- Because unlike you two., I was doing A/B comparisons in real time. Nt - jdaniel@jps.net 10:56:58 08/31/20 (62)
- Please tell us about this Star Trek transporter of yours - Analog Scott 11:59:26 08/31/20 (56)
- Why don't you hold that thought until you reacquaint yourself with the Beecham? The HDTT transfer is - jdaniel@jps.net 12:41:56 08/31/20 (55)
- Doesn't matter - Analog Scott 16:03:48 08/31/20 (54)
- And...your experience playing in Wind Ensembles and Orchestras is...? - jdaniel@jps.net 16:50:58 08/31/20 (53)
- OK, jdaniel - you'll have to explain this - Chris from Lafayette 22:49:17 08/31/20 (22)
- It's absolutely valid to ask a presumed audiophile couch commando whether he expects, say, a triple-forte - jdaniel@jps.net 09:27:46 09/1/20 (21)
- Nice side-step there, jdaniel - Chris from Lafayette 13:01:40 09/1/20 (20)
- What does one do when performing or sitting in on live rehearsals? - jdaniel@jps.net 13:15:50 09/1/20 (19)
- So you're claiming that the only way one will pay attention. . . - Chris from Lafayette 16:40:06 09/1/20 (18)
- Just a point of clarification... - Analog Scott 20:18:30 09/1/20 (13)
- So you're saying it's odd to expect a recording to preserve a hall's reflection of, say, a rim-shot? - jdaniel@jps.net 07:31:46 09/2/20 (7)
- Do you actually read my posts or do you just drop in random responses? - Analog Scott 08:17:11 09/2/20 (6)
- I read all the way through your tortured soliloquy, down to the final, indignant paragraphs, obviously. - jdaniel@jps.net 08:33:50 09/2/20 (5)
- Based on your question it was pretty far from obvious - Analog Scott 09:25:07 09/2/20 (4)
- Aural Illusions... I get it. But does it matter how the brain is tricked? - jdaniel@jps.net 09:47:37 09/2/20 (3)
- What "matters" is subjective - Analog Scott 10:11:23 09/2/20 (2)
- Ultimately, you're saying that "downstream" empirical measurements of any sort are off the table? T - jdaniel@jps.net 10:26:12 09/2/20 (1)
- Nope, not what I am saying either - Analog Scott 12:33:42 09/2/20 (0)
- Yeah - we've had this discussion before [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 01:10:53 09/2/20 (4)
- Do you believe it's "fact" that 5 Channel is more open and natural, dare I say "closer to the live experience" - jdaniel@jps.net 07:45:46 09/2/20 (3)
- For me it is, but for many listeners, it's obviously not - Chris from Lafayette 12:46:40 09/2/20 (2)
- OK then, the superiority of Chabrier in three channel is a matter of opinion. : ) nt - jdaniel@jps.net 12:58:08 09/2/20 (1)
- Indeed! [nt] - Chris from Lafayette 15:42:45 09/2/20 (0)
- Did I say that? It is but one way, and, for the umteenth time, I also mentioned sitting-in on rehearsals, and - jdaniel@jps.net 17:31:04 09/1/20 (3)
- So. . . I just don't know what your point is. . . - Chris from Lafayette 17:47:09 09/1/20 (2)
- You win. Hurwitz prefers the Reiner, BUT, in another vid, he comes dangerously close - jdaniel@jps.net 18:02:21 09/1/20 (1)
- Indeed, just as you don't actively DISlike the Reiner recording. . . - Chris from Lafayette 01:21:12 09/2/20 (0)
- My experience, your experience. None of it matters - Analog Scott 18:20:33 08/31/20 (29)
- Says the guy with no experience. (sigh). I refer you to my visual above. nt - jdaniel@jps.net 18:43:58 08/31/20 (28)
- First of all I have plenty of experience..Second Your experience does not trump an entire field of science - Analog Scott 19:58:39 08/31/20 (27)
- You're making this too difficult. Spacial cues are either retained or they're not. nt - jdaniel@jps.net 09:29:56 09/1/20 (26)
- That's complete Bull**** - Analog Scott 19:19:45 09/1/20 (14)
- I was mocking your Absolutism earlier. Calm down! Damn. nt - jdaniel@jps.net 19:32:07 09/1/20 (13)
- It wasn't absolutism. It was science based reality - Analog Scott 20:25:11 09/1/20 (12)
- All fine and dandy, but I never said the Reiner had zero spacial cues, did I? So many straw men thrown at me, - jdaniel@jps.net 21:33:39 09/1/20 (11)
- but I never you said the Reiner had zero spacial cues, did I? So many straw men thrown at me, - Analog Scott 22:48:04 09/1/20 (10)
- I said it was a fact that the Beecham was **more** open and natural, not **perfectly** open and natural - jdaniel@jps.net 07:44:17 09/2/20 (7)
- Yes that is what you said. and the fact remains that it is not "a fact" - Analog Scott 08:25:22 09/2/20 (6)
- Come on. Is it not a fact that stereo is more open and natural than mono, due to the increased projection of - jdaniel@jps.net 08:44:04 09/2/20 (5)
- First we would have to reach a common understanding of what you mean by open. - Analog Scott 09:35:55 09/2/20 (4)
- We all agree that 60s Columbia Classical sound is, as a rule, not "open." - jdaniel@jps.net 09:54:44 09/2/20 (3)
- first of all you can't just declare a consensus - Analog Scott 12:42:54 09/2/20 (2)
- I believe that most in here of a certain age have heard the same 30 to 50 "reference" recordings, they've - jdaniel@jps.net 13:31:30 09/2/20 (1)
- I don't doubt your confidence that you beleive others know what you are talking about - Analog Scott 09/2/2015:29:43 09/2/20 (0)
- Yup - that's where I kind of lost it! [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 01:23:29 09/2/20 (1)
- (the thread of jdaniel's comments I mean!) [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 01:28:23 09/2/20 (0)
- Or, you could say that spatial cues are either heard or they're not - Chris from Lafayette 13:12:14 09/1/20 (10)
- That's what I was saying all along. What two chan recordings give you that holistic, "you are there" thrill - jdaniel@jps.net 14:14:15 09/1/20 (3)
- OK - I'm done [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 16:45:09 09/1/20 (2)
- You once mentioned there'd be a lot less confusion if everyone listed recordings that exemplified the poesy - jdaniel@jps.net 17:38:52 09/1/20 (1)
- I'm not sure what you mean by "the other way around". . . - Chris from Lafayette 01:17:53 09/2/20 (0)
- RE: Or, you could say that spatial cues are either heard or they're not - pbarach 13:48:22 09/1/20 (5)
- Yes - in that Stokowski recording. . . - Chris from Lafayette 16:43:14 09/1/20 (4)
- Sorry guys, there's absolutely zero. More like listening to a Kandinsky painting. Plus, even the harp - jdaniel@jps.net 17:34:19 09/1/20 (3)
- Well, regardless, I think we're all agreed as to how poorly the engineering turned out [nt] - Chris from Lafayette 01:25:59 09/2/20 (2)
- "Poor engineering...." Fact or opinion? : ) nt - jdaniel@jps.net 09:23:17 09/2/20 (1)
- Opinion, with factual, measurable elements to it [nt] - Chris from Lafayette 12:52:30 09/2/20 (0)
- If you were (doing A/B comparisons in real time). . . - Chris from Lafayette 11:41:43 08/31/20 (4)
- The Beecham isn't perfect, but it's more open and natural with a palpable sense of hall - jdaniel@jps.net 12:39:46 08/31/20 (3)
- It all depends on which hall (or studio) - Chris from Lafayette 16:30:47 08/31/20 (2)
- Did you download the Beecham? nt - jdaniel@jps.net 16:51:39 08/31/20 (1)
- Download? What a quaint notion! - It streams on Qobuz! - Chris from Lafayette 22:41:14 08/31/20 (0)
- I'm sure the Beecham recording is very fine in that respect - Chris from Lafayette 18:22:01 08/30/20 (0)
- Listened the the Reiner with open ears for years. I just don't get the hoopla - jdaniel@jps.net 08:20:39 08/30/20 (10)
- RE: Listened the the Reiner with open ears for years. I just don't get the hoopla - LtMandella 08:47:11 08/30/20 (9)
- Sexism! Sexism! Who will defend women telling stories? [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 11:35:19 08/30/20 (8)
- She kinda had no choice. Nt - jdaniel@jps.net 12:47:05 08/30/20 (7)
- Yeah, but she got emotional about it! Sexism! Sexism! [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 15:04:42 08/30/20 (6)
- RE: Yeah, but she got emotional about it! Sexism! Sexism! [nt] ;-) - LtMandella 10:27:48 08/31/20 (1)
- Well, as you may know, I'm always on the lookout for sexism on this board! [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 11:33:31 08/31/20 (0)
- But if she wasn't more compelling and emotional than Reiner's musicians, then she'd be executed. nt - jdaniel@jps.net 15:15:39 08/30/20 (3)
- Touche - but still sexist! [nt] ;-) - Chris from Lafayette 18:24:29 08/30/20 (2)
- No, the poor harlot was being paid, so to speak, to emote. nt - jdaniel@jps.net 17:57:18 08/31/20 (1)
- Harlot? Even more sexist! [nt] - Chris from Lafayette 22:42:46 08/31/20 (0)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - B. Scarpia 04:50:29 08/30/20 (0)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - flyingdutchman 00:51:23 08/30/20 (10)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - pbarach 10:23:43 08/30/20 (9)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - fstein 14:47:39 08/30/20 (1)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - pbarach 15:10:33 08/30/20 (0)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - rivervalley817 10:50:43 08/30/20 (6)
- One thing Living Stereos were NOT is multi-microphoned - Chris from Lafayette 11:15:29 08/30/20 (1)
- RE: One thing Living Stereos were NOT is multi-microphoned - rivervalley817 14:33:38 08/30/20 (0)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - pbarach 11:01:15 08/30/20 (3)
- RE: Living Stereo Reiner Scheherezade - rivervalley817 11:31:07 08/30/20 (2)
- Do you have an online streaming service? Maybe you could check them that way [nt] - Chris from Lafayette 11:37:35 08/30/20 (1)
- RE: Do you have an online streaming service? Maybe you could check them that way [nt] - rivervalley817 11:54:42 08/30/20 (0)
- If you listen to that Reiner recording over headphones. . . - Chris from Lafayette 19:42:24 08/29/20 (1)
- I have two stand out performances of that Rimsky piece... - TWB 00:39:00 08/30/20 (0)
- I have not kept up with new releases, but, back in the day - John Marks 18:09:07 08/29/20 (2)
- I hated the Gergiev from the first note. (NT) - Kal Rubinson 14:46:26 08/30/20 (1)
- Those Gergiev Philips recordings were mostly engineered poorly IMHO. . . - Chris from Lafayette 15:12:08 08/30/20 (0)
Follow Ups
- I don't doubt your confidence that you beleive others know what you are talking about - Analog Scott 09/2/2015:29:43 09/2/20 (0)
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