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In Reply to: No offense intended (at least by me) posted by John Marks on January 31, 2006 at 11:35:41:
"Re: CDs. Changing the modulus of elasticity makes for a "floppier" CD with more self-damping. The theory is that it flutters less while rotating than a more rigid CD (all CDs are out of round and out of balance, just to tolerance specs), thereby putting less load on the focus-correct and tracking-correct circuits. So far, so good. "A floppier cd that vibrates less than a rigid one??? Oh really! Talk about faulty logic... How is it that all these waves that will be traveling up and down the cd (like a Manger driver!!) now because it is floppier going to affect a focusing laser that must be accurate on the micrometer scale???
If cryogenic treatment affects anything about polycarbonate it will likely affect the refractive index of the material slightly. This means that laser passing through will be offset by a slightly different amount than it was before because as you know due to Snell's law the amount the light bends is a function of the refractive index between air(or vacuum or other material) and the material the light passes into. This offset could be enough to result in jitter (because the 1 and 0 are now timing a bit different because the definition of the edge could have changed), in which case the cd could sound worse (or better if it actually reduced jitter). Does that sound more plausible to you? I have no idea if it is right but it is more likely a cause than your floppy/rigid explanation.
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Follow Ups Full ThreadTopic - OK: Please list all the "bad" products - John Marks 14:45:32 01/30/06 (187)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - RGA 11:52:24 02/7/06 (0)
- A modest proposal - Larry I 07:29:15 02/1/06 (6)
- Well OK, but let's keep it relevant, - bjh 11:37:05 02/1/06 (0)
- LET 550 FLOWERS BLOOM!!!!! Important--Please Read & Bored Please Read - John Marks 07:45:32 02/1/06 (4)
- I'm bored. - Bruce from DC 12:47:01 02/1/06 (2)
- Re: I'm bored. - regmac 16:37:08 02/1/06 (1)
- I think the word I'm looking for is "caritas." (nt) - Bruce from DC 06:08:35 02/2/06 (0)
- I was just kidding. . . - Larry I 09:18:19 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - ril 20:48:56 01/31/06 (1)
- I don't think of ATC as "prosumer" - John Marks 04:53:45 02/1/06 (0)
- No attempt to clearly differentiate between good, very good and excellent products -- here's how to review objectively - Richard BassNut Greene 07:50:03 01/31/06 (63)
- A More Positive View - andy19191 15:25:08 01/31/06 (0)
- I don't need or want to be told what best - lancelot 12:15:47 01/31/06 (1)
- Thanks for your kind words - John Marks 15:41:18 01/31/06 (0)
- Wires... - mkuller 10:36:02 01/31/06 (30)
- I'll bet two cents that was a typical high-end PHONY "blind review" - Richard BassNut Greene 07:11:19 02/1/06 (29)
- Walter Swanbon and Clark Johnsen, tested by Dr. Philip Green. nt - clarkjohnsen 14:56:17 02/1/06 (1)
- Care to tell us ANY details at all ... or do you have something to hide? - Richard BassNut Greene 07:52:42 02/3/06 (0)
- Ok, Mr. Nut, time to shut up... - mkuller 11:59:35 02/1/06 (24)
- I think you must be reading between the lines - Richard BassNut Greene 12:15:10 02/1/06 (23)
- Then pull out your copy... - mkuller 16:07:42 02/1/06 (22)
- You were data mining ... and wrong. ... I'll be kind enough to help you understand the data in the article - Richard BassNut Greene 07:50:53 02/2/06 (10)
- Re: You were data mining ... and wrong. ... I'll be kind enough to help you understand the data in the article - regmac 12:21:38 02/2/06 (0)
- Your response should not surprise anyone... - mkuller 12:16:48 02/2/06 (8)
- Let's review the blind wire test objectively (without cherry picking the one sentence that you really liked ) - Richard BassNut Greene 07:46:30 02/3/06 (3)
- Thanks for your spin on the test, Mr. Nut..... - mkuller 14:12:06 02/3/06 (2)
- You're welcome! ... I hoped you learned something today - Richard BassNut Greene 14:30:12 02/3/06 (1)
- No, again you're wrong... - mkuller 15:05:53 02/4/06 (0)
- And if you want... - mkuller 14:32:16 02/2/06 (0)
- "This is about the only published DBT of speaker wires I'm aware of. It's from 1983" - Ivan303 12:46:45 02/2/06 (2)
- Nice try, but... - mkuller 13:44:36 02/2/06 (1)
- Re: Nice try, but... - Ivan303 14:04:50 02/2/06 (0)
- Re: Then pull out your copy... - andy19191 01:41:16 02/2/06 (0)
- So we now have conclusive evidence.... - Ivan303 17:45:04 02/1/06 (9)
- Stereo review's policy on wires , verses Hot Rod's. - beach cruiser 12:21:42 02/2/06 (0)
- "Looks like it's time to upgrade my cables!" - bjh 19:09:48 02/1/06 (7)
- Re: "it's time for Nut to STFU!" - Ivan303 06:36:14 02/2/06 (6)
- Funny, I read the same thing. - bwkendall 13:34:44 02/2/06 (0)
- Cute! - bjh 08:07:31 02/2/06 (4)
- Thanks, - Ivan303 08:35:09 02/2/06 (3)
- The Nut will never STFU, ... - bjh 09:00:54 02/2/06 (2)
- So ... want to join my fan club? - Richard BassNut Greene 09:36:56 02/2/06 (1)
- Ah, makes me look bad? Perhaps in the eyes of Mr. Nut fans, but what care I what fools think? LOL nt - bjh 11:58:50 02/2/06 (0)
- Re: I'll bet two cents that was a typical high-end PHONY "blind review" - regmac 08:05:55 02/1/06 (1)
- Re: I'll bet two cents that was a typical high-end PHONY "blind review" - Pat D 13:07:42 02/2/06 (0)
- Re: a "quick" read - Bruce from DC 10:03:28 01/31/06 (1)
- Re: a "quick" read - RGA 12:15:36 02/7/06 (0)
- Deep sigh - John Marks 10:00:11 01/31/06 (0)
- Some examples, please - John Atkinson 09:07:14 01/31/06 (24)
- 500+ Recommended Components is not a useful list -- it takes courage to pick the top 5% or 10% -- do you have courage? - Richard BassNut Greene 10:10:15 01/31/06 (23)
- Asshole! nt - bjh 11:10:40 01/31/06 (7)
- ???????????????????? nt - Ivan303 11:20:38 01/31/06 (6)
- That's my honest reaction - bjh 11:44:56 01/31/06 (5)
- Are you are referring to JA ( I assume) ? - Richard BassNut Greene 08:50:36 02/1/06 (1)
- Do yourself a favor. - bwkendall 15:23:17 02/2/06 (0)
- Petulant twit - mt10425 11:52:43 01/31/06 (2)
- Would it be presumptuous of me to surmise you're one who watches auto races just to see the wrecks? nt - bjh 11:57:46 01/31/06 (1)
- Yes, it would. - mt10425 12:01:40 01/31/06 (1)
- Re: 500+ Recommended Components is not a useful list -- it takes courage to pick the top 5% or 10% -- do you have courag - John Atkinson 10:59:13 01/31/06 (11)
- Entire defense of the 500+ item list = "But I don't feel it needs to be pared down" (that's it?) - Richard BassNut Greene 08:10:30 02/1/06 (0)
- Apparently, it is a position that a group of people feel needs to be filled. - bwkendall 17:04:18 01/31/06 (4)
- Please provide details on your strong character attack on me - Richard BassNut Greene 08:18:14 02/1/06 (3)
- Per your request. - bwkendall 08:33:22 02/1/06 (2)
- I defend my advice because it would have led to a fair result - Richard BassNut Greene 09:01:22 02/1/06 (1)
- Neither does a manufacturer or consumer... - mkuller 10:33:32 02/1/06 (0)
- A lot of lazy people out there - Larry I 16:22:25 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: 500+ Recommended Components is not a useful list -- it takes courage to pick the top 5% or 10% -- do you have courag - chris keating 14:42:28 01/31/06 (1)
- The 500+ list is relative to perhaps 5 products tested each month (not to all audio products available to the public) - Richard BassNut Greene 08:26:25 02/1/06 (0)
- Aparently he has a big one... - mkuller 13:13:08 01/31/06 (0)
- OK, I guess it was worth it. The wait for your reply, I mean. You *almost* but not quite called him a ninnie. nt - clarkjohnsen 11:34:56 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: 500+ Recommended Components is not a useful list -- it takes courage to pick the top 5% or 10% -- do you have courag - Enophile 10:48:44 01/31/06 (0)
- John: Personally I would neither "huff" nor "puff" nor even dignify the above post with a reply. The man clearly has... - clarkjohnsen 10:32:46 01/31/06 (1)
- I'll give you credit for one thing: A good sense of humor! - Richard BassNut Greene 08:30:43 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: No attempt to clearly differentiate between good, very good and excellent products -- here's how to review objectiv - bjh 08:20:23 01/31/06 (0)
- Great challenge - Larry I 07:24:43 01/31/06 (0)
- Sorry, I should have been more precise - John Marks 07:09:14 01/31/06 (0)
- Intelligent Chips, colored pebbles, wooden disks . . . - Pat D 00:11:07 01/31/06 (22)
- Re: Intelligent Chips, colored pebbles, wooden disks . . . - thetubeguy1954 11:27:55 02/1/06 (13)
- Hey man, - bjh 12:08:15 02/1/06 (12)
- Re: Hey man, - thetubeguy1954 14:00:18 02/1/06 (11)
- Re: Hey man, - Pat D 18:32:21 02/1/06 (4)
- Please Explain More - thetubeguy1954 05:44:08 02/2/06 (3)
- Re: Please Explain More - Pat D 12:25:45 02/2/06 (2)
- Re: Please Explain More - thetubeguy1954 12:50:55 02/2/06 (1)
- Re: Please Explain More - Pat D 16:05:39 02/2/06 (0)
- Re: Hey man, - bjh 14:09:31 02/1/06 (5)
- Re: Hey man, - thetubeguy1954 14:38:41 02/1/06 (4)
- There you go again, - bjh 15:15:52 02/1/06 (3)
- Re: There you go again, - thetubeguy1954 06:34:12 02/2/06 (2)
- Ok, we're talking all about *you* again, well then let me add the observation that you have ... - bjh 12:09:30 02/2/06 (1)
- Re: Ok, we're talking all about *you* again, well then let me add the observation that you have ... - thetubeguy1954 14:18:33 02/2/06 (0)
- You've heard them ALL??... And they ALL "sound bad"?? - clarkjohnsen 10:28:21 01/31/06 (6)
- They don't do much of anything to the sound as far as anyone has been able to prove. - Pat D 18:31:50 01/31/06 (5)
- You were invited to name "bad-sounding" products. You named things you hadn't heard. SO VERY TYPICAL. You relied on... - clarkjohnsen 10:07:14 02/1/06 (3)
- You should learn to read what's there, Clark. - Pat D 15:08:10 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: You were invited to name "bad-sounding" products. You named things you hadn't heard. SO VERY TYPICAL. You relied on. - bjh 13:25:06 02/1/06 (1)
- 'm ashamed of myself... nt - clarkjohnsen 13:57:32 02/1/06 (0)
- Bad on the finances???... - Wellfed 23:02:33 01/31/06 (0)
- OK - John Marks 07:12:31 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - andy_c 22:17:05 01/30/06 (1)
- In search of audio's early Corvair - John Marks 07:17:23 01/31/06 (0)
- I think maybe you've got it wrong... - mkuller 20:11:15 01/30/06 (1)
- Re: I think maybe you've got it wrong... - Mike Currie 04:53:35 01/31/06 (0)
- One Word - Triangle - groove 19:20:26 01/30/06 (4)
- I expected that! - John Marks 07:20:41 01/31/06 (2)
- Re: I expected that! - groove 12:36:07 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: I expected that! - John Atkinson 10:34:25 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: One Word - Triangle - vettracer 19:46:16 01/30/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - J-PMatt@Comcast.Net 19:05:45 01/30/06 (3)
- The only reason you know that is because we told you. - John Marks 07:23:58 01/31/06 (1)
- Re: The only reason you know that is because we told you. - J-PMatt@Comcast.Net 15:57:24 01/31/06 (0)
- generally I agree, except... - robert young 21:53:46 01/30/06 (0)
- Harmonic Tech Cyberlight Interconects - vettracer 19:00:07 01/30/06 (5)
- On the other hand, to me and *many* others they sound great! However, they do have a "sensitivity" problem. nt - clarkjohnsen 10:20:33 01/31/06 (0)
- Thanks for pointing that out. - John Marks 07:26:17 01/31/06 (3)
- Re: Thanks for pointing that out. - John Atkinson 09:02:13 01/31/06 (2)
- Huh? - vettracer 07:21:32 02/1/06 (0)
- Thanks for pointing that out - John Marks 10:14:41 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - TomLarson 18:45:30 01/30/06 (19)
- How about this? "Most all are basically competent, soem are better than others"? - John Marks 07:31:42 01/31/06 (18)
- Wait a minute! - morricab 08:44:46 01/31/06 (17)
- No....wait two minutes. - bwkendall 17:10:34 01/31/06 (8)
- Hey BWK, I've waited two minutes :^) - thetubeguy1954 10:32:41 02/1/06 (5)
- I may have read it sideways, but it seems - bwkendall 12:09:13 02/1/06 (4)
- That's the "latchkey audio" concept I wrote about. nt - clarkjohnsen 14:50:21 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: I may have read it sideways, but it seems - thetubeguy1954 12:33:03 02/1/06 (2)
- All you SET guys (and gals) say the same thing. - bwkendall 13:12:45 02/1/06 (1)
- Tend to agree. nt - clarkjohnsen 14:51:18 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: No....wait two minutes. - QuadTodd 18:31:20 01/31/06 (1)
- You got it! -t - bwkendall 13:37:36 02/1/06 (0)
- Bravo! - thetubeguy1954 10:27:25 01/31/06 (0)
- Your cure is worse than my disease - John Marks 10:26:01 01/31/06 (6)
- You Are Right & Wrong - thetubeguy1954 13:31:33 01/31/06 (5)
- I am not being disingenuous, I am tired - John Marks 15:29:57 01/31/06 (2)
- Re: I am not being disingenuous, I am tired - thetubeguy1954 08:24:05 02/1/06 (1)
- That he would be tired - bjh 14:01:59 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: You Are Right & Wrong - John Atkinson 13:56:17 01/31/06 (1)
- Re: You Are Right & Wrong - thetubeguy1954 05:53:41 02/1/06 (0)
- You specifically avoided an (if not the *most) important issue for many. - Rick W 18:38:31 01/30/06 (8)
- Here's the secret (don't tell anyone) - John Marks 07:39:07 01/31/06 (7)
- Hmm, half an ass is better than none? - Rick W 10:23:51 01/31/06 (6)
- I sincerely believe that... - John Marks 15:08:54 01/31/06 (5)
- Re: I sincerely believe that... - morricab 07:56:24 02/1/06 (3)
- Re: I sincerely believe that... - John Atkinson 10:22:12 02/1/06 (0)
- I agree that you are "3. One who tends to make harsh or carping judgments; a faultfinder." - John Marks 09:46:47 02/1/06 (1)
- Re: I agree that you are "3. One who tends to make harsh or carping judgments; a faultfinder." - morricab 12:43:35 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: I sincerely believe that... - JTimothyA 00:16:27 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - Mike Currie 17:57:21 01/30/06 (1)
- Only while wearing a biohazard suit, one should hope - John Marks 07:46:02 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - Shane from AUS 17:19:05 01/30/06 (2)
- Thanks - John Marks 07:49:15 01/31/06 (1)
- Re: Thanks - Shane from AUS 14:54:06 01/31/06 (0)
- human hearing - beach cruiser 17:06:12 01/30/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - cjfrbw 16:07:12 01/30/06 (3)
- THANK YOU! - John Marks 16:32:24 01/30/06 (2)
- Recognize that those of us who use our real names ... - Dave Pogue 04:49:22 01/31/06 (1)
- Bose v. Consumers' Union, __ U.S. __ (198X) - John Marks 07:55:02 01/31/06 (0)
- Re: OK: Please list all the "bad" products - Enophile 15:21:09 01/30/06 (22)
- Sorry - John Marks 16:05:59 01/30/06 (17)
- Scary thought... - Jim Austin 17:41:42 01/30/06 (0)
- Are you retelling results, or opinions ? - beach cruiser 17:40:04 01/30/06 (7)
- Both - John Marks 08:08:41 01/31/06 (6)
- Thank you for the reply, - beach cruiser 10:57:23 01/31/06 (5)
- No offense intended (at least by me) - John Marks 11:35:41 01/31/06 (4)
- Re: No offense intended (at least by me) - morricab 02/1/0608:20:24 02/1/06 (0)
- The thrill is gone - beach cruiser 18:11:31 01/31/06 (2)
- The Compact Disc is an analog medium, read by analog means - John Marks 05:24:33 02/1/06 (1)
- Thanks again for the reply - beach cruiser 13:20:06 02/1/06 (0)
- Re: Sorry - Enophile 16:50:32 01/30/06 (7)
- Re: Sorry - Grant 10:59:50 01/31/06 (0)
- Greetings, earthling! (that was a joke) - John Marks 08:35:19 01/31/06 (2)
- Okay, he's an earthling. - bwkendall 12:07:18 01/31/06 (0)
- Holy Cow! - Enophile 09:07:05 01/31/06 (0)
- Participation in this thread is limited to earthlings. - bwkendall 16:56:13 01/30/06 (2)
- Re: Participation in this thread is limited to earthlings. - Enophile 17:03:38 01/30/06 (1)
- I read your response above and below, - bwkendall 17:16:45 01/30/06 (0)
- Thank you for playing, please try again. - bwkendall 15:48:54 01/30/06 (3)
- Re: Thank you for playing, please try again. - Enophile 16:01:48 01/30/06 (2)
- O-k-a-y. L-e-t-'-s t-r-y J-M-'-s q-u-e-s-t-i-o-n a-g-a-i-n. - bwkendall 16:21:46 01/30/06 (1)
- Re: O-k-a-y. L-e-t-'-s t-r-y J-M-'-s q-u-e-s-t-i-o-n a-g-a-i-n. - Enophile 17:02:20 01/30/06 (0)
- Was the 'lil Rat ever reviewed? - gd 15:04:38 01/30/06 (0)
- Well now *that's* an angle. I presume you don't want the merely overrated... nt - clarkjohnsen 15:04:16 01/30/06 (1)
- Right as usual, Clark - John Marks 15:19:52 01/30/06 (0)
- Man, I can't wait to see if anyone replies!!! - EdM 14:51:54 01/30/06 (3)
- The "worst" review I can remember writing - John Marks 15:10:07 01/30/06 (1)
- JM - is this a valid point? - jdarby 10:25:04 02/2/06 (0)
- Somehow I have a feeling that the - kavakidd 15:04:52 01/30/06 (0)
Follow Ups
- Re: No offense intended (at least by me) - morricab 02/1/0608:20:24 02/1/06 (0)