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In Reply to: I like fast cars.... posted by dado5 on January 23, 2003 at 17:51:41:
Ok.. time for another analogy.My car company, skin motors inc., has developed a new technology. Helium inflated tires...
Everybody is aware that helium has a higher heat capacity than normal air..Much higher...
When you drive down the road on a sunny day, your tires warm up...sometimes, dangerously so. Rubber compounds are rated for temperature, friction, inflation pressure, hardness, treadwear...
Knowing tires are adversly affected by temperature, it is in your best interest to keep them cool..It's your safety and the safety of your family that matters most..
Our new helium inflators...solve all that..Tires run cooler, gas mileage with cooler tires is improved, and, turbulent flow within the tires, a bane to traction and cornering, is reduced because helium is lighter.
Specially trained race car drivers have tested our product, and they can tell the difference, say it's much better..traction, handling.
And, since helium liquifies at a much lower temperature that any other gas, it's viscosity curve has a higher temperature performance ratio than any other noble gas. Period..
Now...explain to me what in this analogy is incorrect?? None, I made sure of that...Will everybody go out and buy them??No..Why??? Because it's totally made up??Please,,,it's all science fact..no errors here..Wherein lies the issue???Some drivers swear by it!!!!
Your problem as a consumer??...I'm one of the best cryogenic/helium processing engineers on the planet (not really, just go with it), who are you as a consumer to question me???
C'mon, is the safety of your kids important???
Now...All the big companies are spouting the same trash...Does that mean it is true???No, but it's a competetive market. Some cannot survive without this hype..
The AH article is pointing out one particular effect..Grabbed upon, expounded, but no, repeat, no data of any type is being provided to support the fact that skin makes any difference..
I do not consider the case closed on skin, having just a little bit of knowledge in the area. And, I'm heavily involved in the modelling of the wire to try and prove or disprove multitone modulation. Of course, the e/m physicist I'm dealing with didn't think the effect exists, and is a good sounding board for my ideas...He does however, have an interest in it as I've raised some really good issues, I've produced a hypothesis that has the capability of predicting multitone modulation,,we're trying to test it and derive equations that work while still falling within e/m laws.
But, the people who advertise it have no idea what they are talking about. Period.. Saying skin effect is there, does this or that is totally unsupported, by science, physics, any knowledge to date.
The AH site is trying to dispel the non factual notion that skin effect is an issue at all, and did so using amplitude. They did so using nothing but standard, well proven decades old theory..
I'm trying to change the theory.
The efforts on this site do nothing to change that, people here are just taking potshots, and I don't see anybody trying to resolve the issue..You want to disagree with their facts...Present your own facts. Don't try to baffle.
And in my opinion, no "respectable engineer" would sell something that is not supported by facts.
It's ok to give opinions, build hypothesis', provide info..But, give facts to back up things pushed as facts, state hypothesis as such.
Now..as to your remark..""The tone of the article was entirely dismissive of the idea that skin effect phenomena (amplitude measured only as was noted in another post)has any audible consequences.""
Why shouldn't it be?? Do you have any data, any information at all that says it does??? Perhaps some phase shift measurements?? Anything??
No, you don't. It's ok,,you can say that.. Really..no, no, no. There that's easy.
Does it mean that there is no effect??? Not by a long shot. Just means you don't have data or science to back up your belief. AH used only tried and true. Want to disprove facts? Use facts. If and when I can, I will.
TTFN, John
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Follow Ups
- Re: pentode grids and waterstreams :-) - John Escallier 01/24/0317:43:35 01/24/03 (2)
- Re: pentode grids and waterstreams :-) - john curl 19:13:00 01/24/03 (1)
- Re: pentode grids and waterstreams :-) - John Escallier 05:18:57 01/25/03 (0)
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