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General Asylum: I Could Rig Such a Test to Make One Easily Pass It! ;^) by Todd Krieger General audio topics that don't fit into specific categories. |
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In Reply to: Rig a DBT??? Ah yes, the "agenda" thing rears its head again. posted by waVeman on September 13, 2002 at 17:01:47:
"I have yet to figure out why so many here think DBT believers have some kind of dark and twisted plan to keep people from enjoying the hobby of audio."I never implied that.
"Really, EXACTLY what do you think our true reason is for wanting proof that cables make audible differences?"
To be honest, I don't really care. I once tried to submit "proof," but nobody ever accepted it- they only further-questioned it- It ultimately got to the point where I came to the reality that they had no intention of ever accepting it... So I figured it's not worth the time and effort to satisfy their demands... (I just grin and bear it.)
"If anything, we (i.e. objectivists) should be suspicious of certain cable believers that write here: how do I know one of those faceless posters doesn't work for a hi-end cable manufacturer, or, was asked by one to write a post praising Company XYZ's products?"
I'd be happy to send you a photo of me... [-;
Ah... It's a conspiracy!! ;-]
This goes on all the time, but not exclusively with cables.
"Personally, I have never been approached by a swarthy character in a dark overcoat, black fedora & wearing Raybans, offering me cash rewards for dissing cable believers and their exotic $100/foot "Super Coherent Electron Conduits". All so I can furthur the cause of.......what?"
I never implied it was in the form of a pushy salesman. In fact, it was something that one would have to seek out. It was never heavily advertised or talked about.
"And its hilarious to see the mental gymnastics so many cable believers go through to discredit DBTs--or ANY kind of scientifically-based listening test for that matter--used to try to find the truth."
I'm not really a "cable believer." (I think the terminations have more sonic degradation than the wire between them.) In fact, I adhere to a lot of the rules of impedance, inductance, and capacitance the "objectivists" like to bring up. I won't even discredit DBT- If one likes to use it, that's perfectly fine!! It just doesn't do anything for me *personally*.
"If anybody is sucking the life out of this hobby, I very much believe it isn't us 'cold and calculating' objectivists."
Once again, I never implied that it did. My only objection (pun intended) with some (but not all) "objectivists" is the near-militant attitude they have toward those who either choose alternative evaluation methodologies or discuss products that seem meritless (or even hideous) based solely on "objectivist" criteria. And I think this militant and seemingly-condescending attitude has caused some resentment amongst audiophiles toward the objectivists.
It's no different from my objection with "Bose bashers," who outwardly criticize those who merely show an interest with Bose products. (I guess if audiophiles get criticized for purchasing exotic cable, they turn around and criticize people for purchasing Bose.)
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Topic - My opinion on Blind Testing - ENB 12:52:12 09/13/02 ( 68)
- My opinion of your opinion... misguided - jj 02:07:30 09/19/02 ( 0)
Re: My opinion on Blind Testing - audioengr 14:40:55 09/17/02 ( 0)
Audio is not only audio - prte79 00:08:24 09/14/02 ( 4)
- Re: Audio is not only audio - audioengr 14:46:02 09/17/02 ( 1)
- Now HOLD the phone there, dude! not SO FAST! - jj 02:24:01 09/19/02 ( 0)
The problem is that very few people who use DBT actually understand the methodology - Hirsch 11:33:04 09/16/02 ( 1)
- And make priori judgements... - E-Stat 16:55:01 09/16/02 ( 0)
Re: My opinion on Blind Testing - ggraff 20:51:04 09/13/02 ( 7)
- Bullcrap! - jj 02:18:11 09/19/02 ( 0)
Re: My opinion on Blind Testing - Jitter_by_Coffee 06:48:23 09/14/02 ( 2)
- Re: My opinion on Blind Testing - ggraff 05:59:01 09/16/02 ( 1)
- Oh, come on. - jj 02:20:57 09/19/02 ( 0)
Pseudoscience??? - waVeman 23:10:56 09/13/02 ( 2)
- Really, why do you care... - Dave Pogue 04:19:12 09/14/02 ( 1)
- Why do you presume that he does care? - jj 02:19:31 09/19/02 ( 0)
I have assembled a first rate blind listening panel - spacedeckman 20:44:03 09/13/02 ( 1)
- Excellent Point! - audioengr 14:50:28 09/17/02 ( 0)
Re: My opinion on Blind Testing - Monstrous Mike 20:30:36 09/13/02 ( 0)
To emphasize a specific opinion. - ENB 17:13:16 09/13/02 ( 2)
- An intelligent post, but I don't completely agree... - Fred S 21:02:09 09/13/02 ( 0)
I agree - phenderson 18:26:54 09/13/02 ( 0)
Sure, cables can make a difference -- if you build them to! - phenderson 17:07:30 09/13/02 ( 6)
- Re: Sure, cables can make a difference -- if you build them to! - audioengr 15:00:54 09/17/02 ( 0)
Re: MIT Cables - Big Dave 17:35:32 09/13/02 ( 4)
- I also studied at MIT - BrassMonkey 23:52:21 09/13/02 ( 0)
Re: MIT Cables - ggraff 20:37:37 09/13/02 ( 0)
More on Zobel Networks - Big Dave 19:31:41 09/13/02 ( 0)
Thanks for the scoop - phenderson 18:10:19 09/13/02 ( 0)
Some motives are pure (more or less) - sam9 16:06:07 09/13/02 ( 0)
I make my own cables, and.... - BrassMonkey 14:36:36 09/13/02 ( 25)
- Re: I make my own cables, and.... - Analog Scott 20:29:08 09/13/02 ( 2)
- Re: I make my own cables, and.... - BrassMonkey 23:34:51 09/13/02 ( 1)
- Re: I make my own cables, and.... - Analog Scott 23:12:20 09/15/02 ( 0)
I became a cable believer when... - Jim 17:29:55 09/13/02 ( 0)
My Favourite way of Doing Blind Tests... - heath a 17:01:02 09/13/02 ( 1)
- Re: My Favourite way of Doing Blind Tests... - Oscillatus 03:02:15 09/16/02 ( 0)
Re: I make my own cables, and.... - Todd Krieger 15:18:56 09/13/02 ( 18)
- Rig a DBT??? Ah yes, the "agenda" thing rears its head again. - waVeman 17:01:47 09/13/02 ( 17)
- Why is it then... - E-Stat 20:01:53 09/13/02 ( 11)
- I would suggest a tour through the auditory literature to answer your question. - jj 02:11:51 09/19/02 ( 1)
- I know of the mighty creator of the "death start"... - E-Stat 04:13:54 09/19/02 ( 0)
- A switching box is going to color the sound?! - waVeman 21:40:13 09/13/02 ( 8)
- It's not as simple as you think. - jj 02:13:14 09/19/02 ( 0)
- NBS, Shakti, and Bose - Todd Krieger 19:24:48 09/15/02 ( 0)
- Please help me out here, waVeman with your comments - E-Stat 15:48:46 09/15/02 ( 4)
- Re: Please help me out here, waVeman with your comments - audioengr 15:15:31 09/17/02 ( 1)
- Thanks audioengr - E-Stat 17:39:43 09/17/02 ( 0)
- Re: Please help me out here, waVeman with your comments - waVeman 22:48:54 09/15/02 ( 1)
- Disagree and agree, respectively - E-Stat 08:34:41 09/16/02 ( 0)
Not if you mount it on VibraPods and use Mpingo Stones! <nt> - Big Dave 06:17:08 09/14/02 ( 0)
Re: Rig a DBT??? Ah yes, the "agenda" thing rears its head again. - ENB 18:07:03 09/13/02 ( 0)
I Could Rig Such a Test to Make One Easily Pass It! ;^) - Todd Krieger 09/13/02 17:56:27 09/13/02 ( 2)
- Snobbish objectivists - waVeman 22:30:24 09/13/02 ( 1)
- Heaven protect us from "mental clutter" - Dave Pogue 09:34:56 09/14/02 ( 0)
Re: Rig a DBT??? Ah yes, the "agenda" thing rears its head again. - ENB 17:25:24 09/13/02 ( 0)
There's more going on than Placebo Effect - Big Dave 14:13:23 09/13/02 ( 6)
- Re: There's more going on than Placebo Effect - sam9 16:15:19 09/13/02 ( 5)
- The "smiley face" EQ curve! - waVeman 17:50:31 09/13/02 ( 4)
- Next time... - E-Stat 17:55:19 09/15/02 ( 0)
- The fear we dare not name. - sam9 16:01:19 09/15/02 ( 0)
- Yep, "Fletcher/Munson" or "Equal Loudness Curves" - Ted Smith 23:03:36 09/13/02 ( 1)
- Thanks. N/T - waVeman 23:13:30 09/13/02 ( 0)
It's a matter of degree...... - Cut-Throat 13:08:37 09/13/02 ( 5)
- Re: It's a matter of degree...... - sam9 16:23:00 09/13/02 ( 0)
Re: It's a matter of degree...... - ENB 13:45:24 09/13/02 ( 3)
- "Better" to whom? - Bosh 14:34:03 09/13/02 ( 2)
- Re: "Better" to whom? - john curl 14:53:32 09/13/02 ( 1)
- The pharmacutical makers would rush to agree, John <nt> - Bosh 14:55:58 09/13/02 ( 0)